{"id":1959,"date":"2005-11-14T20:16:06","date_gmt":"2005-11-15T04:16:06","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/www.amptoons.com\/blog\/?p=1959"},"modified":"2012-10-02T10:16:31","modified_gmt":"2012-10-02T17:16:31","slug":"1959","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/amptoons.com\/blog\/?p=1959","title":{"rendered":"Right-Wing Libertarians Respond To Nick"},"content":{"rendered":"

Two of my favorite right-wing bloggers, Jane Galt<\/a> and Cathy Young<\/a>, have commented – in a rather unkind fashion – on Nicks’ recent <\/a>posts <\/a>about rape. Jane, responding to Nick’s fantasy of what Nick’s “ideal world” would be like, wrote:\n\n

…it’s stupid. Not only are we not in this utopia, we are never, ever going to be in that utopia. Even if we achieved a marvelously gender-blind society, there would still be some people who want to have sex with people who do not want to have sex with them.<\/em><\/p><\/blockquote>\n

So, to summarize: Nick made it clear she was talking about an “ideal world,” not the real world; Jane responds by saying, in essence, “but your ideal world won’t ever be real.”<\/p>\n

Well, duh<\/em>, Jane. That’s why Nick used <\/em>the phrase “my ideal world,” to distinguish it from the real one.<\/p>\n

Meanwhile, Cathy wrote:<\/a><\/p>\n

But alongside it, another type of double standard has developed as well: one that views unconstrained, selfish, hedonistic female sexuality as “liberated” while condemning similar male behavior as sleazy and exploitative. In this new double standard, the promiscuous or adulterous male is a pig, while the promiscuous or adulterous female is a rebel against the patriarchy.<\/p>\n

This kind of feminism is not about equality and not about female empowerment. It’s about female entitlement.<\/i><\/p><\/blockquote>\n

“This kind of feminism” is not one that Cathy has actually shown exists – say, by quoting a single example of such a feminist. Let alone quoting enough examples to provide evidence of some sort of widespread trend within feminism.<\/p>\n

The prime example – indeed, the only <\/em>example – of a feminist in Cathy’s post is Nick. Under that circumstance, most readers would naturally assume that Nick is an example of the double-standard Cathy’s railing against. But that’s not the case, and Cathy doesn’t bother to clarify this point for her readers who don’t click through.<\/p>\n

Cathy’s argument seems to boil down to this: Nick says one thing; some feminists Cathy doesn’t name have said something different; therefore feminism has developed a double standard.<\/p>\n

I shouldn’t have to explain why Cathy’s argument doesn’t hold water. Feminism is large and varied, and – as any regular “Alas” reader knows – feminists often disagree. (If you ever want to start an endless argument in a room full of feminists, just say “I think prostitution ought be legalized” or “must never be legalized” – either one will do the trick). Nick is under no obligation to agree with Cathy’s unnamed feminists; and the fact that not all feminists agree on everything doesn’t establish some large strain of feminist hypocrisy.<\/p>\n

Are there some feminists out there – out of millions – who actually hold such a double standard? I’m sure there are a few. But in general, the feminists I know are pretty consistent – the ones who favor women fucking around a lot (consensually) are also the ones who don’t see anything wrong with men fucking around a lot (consensually). (For example, you’ll never find Amanda of Pandagon criticizing men merely for wanting to have frequent, consensual, casual sex.)<\/p>\n

Cathy also says:<\/p>\n

In fact, let’s take this a step further. Suppose things didn’t end quite so well for our male Nick. Suppose he actually does get drugged and robbed by the two female strangers he picked up in a bar for sex. Do you think Nick is going to encounter a lot of sympathy for his plight, from men or from women? I seriously doubt it. In fact, I suspect that the response is going to be mainly along the lines of, “he had it coming.” (A male friend to whom I outlined this scenario said, “The word ‘dumbass’ comes to mind.”)<\/i><\/p><\/blockquote>\n

Really? If Cathy says her friends have that reaction, I’ll take her word for it.<\/p>\n

But I’m glad I don’t have her friends. I can’t imagine any of my friends saying “you had it coming” to a robbery victim in the situation Cathy describes, let alone to a rape victim (male or female). Someone who said that sincerely (rather than in an ironic, dark-humored way) would be considered appalling among my friends.<\/p>\n

Cathy’s argument supports my theory that many conservatives are far more anti-male than the typical feminist is. It’s not feminists, after all, arguing that men are incapable of controlling themselves and need to be civilized through marriage to women; that sort of argument is reserved for conservatives like Maggie Gallagher. It’s not feminists who say that men, once in the sex act, are incapable of stopping, like dogs; but it’s a pretty common belief among conservatives (just read the comments following Jane’s post and you’ll find a couple of examples).<\/p>\n

Not all conservatives are like that; I’ve never noticed such anti-male nonsense coming from Cathy or Jane, for example. And for all I know, the friend Cathy quoted was a flaming liberal. But anti-male attitudes such as what Cathy’s friend said, certainly seem more accepted among conservatives than among any of the feminists I hang with.<\/pracut>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"

Two of my favorite right-wing bloggers, Jane Galt and Cathy Young, have commented – in a rather unkind fashion – on Nicks’ recent posts about rape. Jane, responding to Nick’s fantasy of what Nick’s “ideal world” would be like, wrote: … Continue reading →<\/span><\/a><\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":1,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[95,153,96],"tags":[],"class_list":["post-1959","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","hentry","category-anti-feminists-and-their-pals","category-libertarianism-2","category-rape-intimate-violence-related-issues"],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/amptoons.com\/blog\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/posts\/1959","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/amptoons.com\/blog\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/amptoons.com\/blog\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/amptoons.com\/blog\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/users\/1"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/amptoons.com\/blog\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Fcomments&post=1959"}],"version-history":[{"count":1,"href":"https:\/\/amptoons.com\/blog\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/posts\/1959\/revisions"}],"predecessor-version":[{"id":15898,"href":"https:\/\/amptoons.com\/blog\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/posts\/1959\/revisions\/15898"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/amptoons.com\/blog\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Fmedia&parent=1959"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/amptoons.com\/blog\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Fcategories&post=1959"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/amptoons.com\/blog\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Ftags&post=1959"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}